One of the complaints today is that young Black men are ignoring church/God. I used to wonder why until I spent a while at First Baptist and watched some of the other churches dealing out Candy Theology and Spineless Spirituality.
The distillation of all of that uselessness and candy is pretty much illustrated in the video clip below. A tip of the hat to Judge Not for finding it for me.
In the second half of the video clip, I thought I was being taught a new dance step by the world famous Oneness preacher (who spoke at First Baptist Church of Glenarden, pastored by John Kenneth Jenkins by the way) Charles Ellis.
The “stepping into my destiny” move was not as bad as I thought it would be, because all he did was take a phrase that is used constantly in many churches and make it a physical movement. Yes, I know it looked like Electric Slide time at a wedding, but it could have been worse. The little boy being pulled on the stage was what really bothered me. If this child is authentically praising God, why stop him and bring him on stage? By the way, this is a great site Melvin.
funny, i just saw the video. And i really thought that the entire church was going to bust into either the electric slide or the tootsie roll. Its nice they had a shoutin’ down good time, unfortunately no truth.
can you explain to me what you’re talking about when you say that Grace( GGT) has no truth ? and how do you know, what do you know about truth? just because a church like that is praise God because they know what the lord is getting ready to do for them, doesn’t make them fake.
enrique, what time do you have to preach truth when you are busy dancing, spinning around, and running around the church like the Indianapolis 500? 99% of the time events like this aren’t equiping the saints to deny self, study to show themselves approved, be discipline, prepare for persecusion, seek God’s will, or avoid sin. No, most times the preaching is geared towards “getting over”. A ‘Shadrack, Meshak and Abendigo’ message.
Hardly anything is preached about personal accountability for ones sins. Nor is there anything about Godly sorrow to the point of repentance, beyond just telling God i’m sorry. Again its about making money, how to sow a seed, how to get a man (for the ladies in the house), how to tap into your blessing, and speaking dominion and authority into your life. What they (the contemporary American church) preach, and what the scriptures preach are two different messages.
That’s what i mean
Gosh Enrique……….when precisely is God going to actually DO SOMETHING for you poor souls rather than just keeping the Holy Carrot strung before your noses??
Every year it’s……….
THE YEAR OF BREAKTHROUGH
THE YEAR OF BLESSINGS AND ABUNDANCE
THE YEAR OF BREAKING BONDAGES
THE YEAR OF JUBILEE
THE YEAR OF THE OVERCOMER
For the love of Pete, use your brain. If you had a contractor building you a home, and he kept asking you for money but nothing ever got built, would you keep pumping money into him??
I guess you would if he kept saying “Don’t worry Enrique…………….THIS IS THE YEAR OF FOUNDATIONS. Then you would shovel more cash at him, until the next year when he would tell you it was THE YEAR OF WALLS AND WINDOWS.
BTW…………can I be your contractor??
How do you know what God is getting ready to do?
Chuckie (that’s what his long-time friends call him) and the boys look like another Detroit favorite group, The Temptations! This is just sheer foolishness.
no its not, you perfer the dead church, with itching ears, they don’t act like that there.
I appreciate the truth that this website stands for, unfortunately most of the so called people of God love to deal in emotionalism and other i feel good things. Not being lead by sound doctrine but how i feel. So it is easy for enemies of the cross to come in and(sift them like wheat) distort what God said and twist what the Gospel is about. Keep going Melvin still plenty of us who love the truth.
I won’t to know why the church never stops asking for money? They say give until it hurts but guess what they don’t look like their hurting to me if they can do the bogalo slide
Boy!They are really getting down!Forget about going out to the club or to a house party,you can get your “dance on” at church!The church muscians are there to rock the crowd and shake all of the money out of your pockets.lol
Didn’t know where to put this, but since Noel is in the same organization as Ellis, thought this was a decent spot:
The Weasle and the singer
(MN: Espcially note what the weasel says near the end of the article and what the writer says in her comments. )
Religion at its finest! All of this shoutin’ and most, if not all will leave this sevice POWERLESS!!! More of the same ol “breakthru, season, harvest and destiny” garbage spoken by all of the pimps and pimplings (those who watch them on tv and imitate them in their own churches) than has no NO EFFECT on holiness or righteousness. It does get these guys nice cars though!!! Shame, shame, shame…
I don’t post here that often, but I read. That video has grieved me to the core. A bunch of cotton candy. I know if someone invited me to a church like that, I think I would’ve walked out or headed to the nearest toliet to hurl…I feel sorry for that lil’ boy who is shouting, just to imitate the women around him! So sad! The men look like puppets following their “master”…so sad…I am a single woman and sorry, I wouldn’t want a man like that! LOL
I don’t blame you, you don’t need a man period if you don’t want one that is a true praiser and a worshipper and I also don’t blame you if you saide you would turn around and walk out and hurl to the next toliet. should you’ve visited a church like that, Because its not good to go to a church you don’t like because a lot of mess would be started
Enrique….
Please stop trying to justify the house party!
After all is said and done…are the people living
holy lives and demonstrating the life of Christ?
Too many times, the black church is seeking out
a good shout and a chicken dinner afterwards.
I bet you two dollars to a donut that after the
jam session, it was offering time. Not a
coincidence of timing.
With all of that “crossing over”, poll the same
people six months from now and find out how
many are still in attendance and how many
have specific testimonies of crossing over and
the manifestations.
Thanks Lafe. You know everybody, I am going to write a blog (I am sure Melville has) but I wonder how many of the sheep here (as lost as most are) would really love God if he did nothing else for them other than give them Eternal Life. If God allowed these individuals to be stricken with a terminal illness, lose their jobs, houses and nice cars, or even took a love one I really wonder will they still “love God”. I think the answer would be “no.”.
I have seen so many people fall away once the sun came out and the heat was turned up. The problem is that most of these people were promised something of worldy value or that their spouse and children would become healthy or would stop giviing them trouble, or they wouldn’t have future trials and persecution. The thing is I am saddened by this when I turn on the television and I see these false teachers promising everything is going to work out for these individuals fleshly (I want to emphasize this because “all things work out for the good” for believers) good when the truth is it may not.
I just want you guys who read this and happen to be on the WOF side to be aware that these guys are promising something they can’t give like selling real estate they don’t own and you are buying 100’s of acres. Don’t get duped please. God promises us eternal life. Anything beyond that is extra. Please read Hebrews 11, because so many people stop before they read verses 35-40. I just want to say I really do love these guys (the people who respond so negatively, including Enrique) who think we need to be delivered from Demons, need an emotional high to get through each week, or somehow equate God’s hand on something by counting numbers.
If you ever get tired of the circus, the nights of feeling defeated when you are all alone (I know each night, I had to muster up the strength to go put on another show so Pastor won’t look like a fool up there), tired of constantly sinning when no one’s looking but acting like everything is peachy, and finally knowing you are faking it and have never really experienced the Grace of our Lord and true fellowship with him, then shoot me an email at lionelwoods@hotmail.com.
I know you may be scared to leave what you are comfortable with, or even confused, but so many of us here have experienced it and want to help. If we seem arrogant or judgmental forgive us. We are just tired of seeing people being taken advantage of and want to help our sisters and brothers in the Lord. If you email me I will not be harsh, I just want to share some things with you and provide you with a resource to help you through. I have seen so many turn to wickedness and a hate towards God after being abused and I don’t want to see you (those who are being mislead) go through. I did and it wasn’t pleasent. God bless,
In Love Lionel.
a friend of mine responded to me with this comment after I sent her the link:
This craziness is SHAMEFUL!!! i remember when i went to greater mount calvary. we were all caught up in that insanity. if i didn’t know where they were and there was no music, i would think these folks were in an asylum. gracious sakes. and besides that, i remember that after all that … we came out with NO POWER, as another comment noted. none. we were sweaty and caught up in a frenzie, talking about “that was good,” but no power.
craziness.
and you can post these comments if you like.
my goodness.
that poor little boy. he’ll grow up to think going through all those contortions is “praising God.” i hope he doesn’t end up with sexual identity issues or lust problems or anger concerns because the same religion he danced to didn’t teach him the true Gospel that leads to repentance.
I agree that we need to pray for them, that the truth will be revealed to them.
what is the truth?I’ve visited that church several times and they teach the truth. and that little boy is going to grow up and be a mighty warrior in the kingdom of God regardless of what anyone on this website has to say about him
have you left God’s house delivered ? while you’re talkin about them? I must know. haters are not going to heaven
Well I grew up in the P.A.W. churches and this is how services were every sunday and all the time, but we were taught that how your are outside the church shows your true colors. In sunday school we were warned about the false prophets, so I’m not suprised at the trash ideologies on televison. I like this site it really makes you second guess all the super preachers and swindlers of the poor folks. Kerney Thomas is the artificial like nutra sweet. He uses no biblical foundations and speaks in false toungues. Matthew explains more on these false prophets.
I saw this a couple of weeks ago on you tube when Charles Eliis was doing the crossover as he called it. I used to think this mess was church. Boy was I a dip stick.
Mike,
don’t be so hard on yourself. You were trying to find a community of believers. You didn’t do anything wrong. You got out a lot faster than I did. Sometimes I am angry about the time I loss. But what armour we aquired by seeing through these false teachers. We are now equipped to help others. It wasn’t all in vain.
Edra is right…………..10 years for me Mike. You’re not alone.
Let’s analyze the actual words at the height of this “crossover” session. What he asked the crowd to recite.
Notice the context of his statements. He’s talking about EARTHLY GAIN.
He’s speaking against patience. He’s speaking against waiting for true gain in Heaven. He wants all that he spoke of RIGHT NOW. Our true “destiny” is not of this world, so to claim you can cross over into it now would involve them all dropping dead from their dancing.
And why oh why, do saved people keep crying out for “anointing”, when Christians are anointed by the Holy Spirit? They treat it like a temporal condition that comes and goes with the size of their bank accounts! If they want MORE of anything they need to read MORE of their Bibles and stop thinking everything spoken to Jews in the Old Testament applies to them in monetary terms.
If you think that was some good stuff in that video, Read 2 Timothy 3 and once you’re done with it, think about the fact PAUL WAS BEHEADED. Oh yea, he faced a lot and was delivered, to go on to have his head in a basket! Think you’re better than the apostles? Think you deserve some earthly gain after God gave His only begotten Son to die for our sorry sins? The Son who turned down an offer of earthly gain from Satan himself. Luke 4:5-8
Some folks have to stop focusing on what the Jews got and realize what the apostles got. Many are in this faith for all the wrong reasons!
so it leaves one to wonder if many are even in the faith at all. 2 Cor. 13:5
(MN: Now you’re starting to understand the full magnitude of the pimps’ behavior. And you’re not claiming to be able to see into their hearts to reach the conclusions you are reaching. Take a look at 2 John 9,10 as well. I really have no problem seeing most of these pimps, if not all of them, being told by Jesus “Get away from me you workers of iniquity. I never knew you. But think about the people who were following them and thought they themselves were saved. One lady I know says “He might not be right, but he’s not going to send me to hell.” To which I must respond “What about the people who are unsaved and join a church under the lies of this magnitude. They could easily end up in hell. Don’t you have any responsibility for getting the truth to them if it is in your power to do so? All I get back is a blank, non-comprehending stare. )
While trying to help, we’ve got to pray, pray, pray for these people to see the truth.
2 Peter 2:18-22
Well MN seriously, witnessing the little boy being encouraged to partake in the foolishness was a bit sobering. Given the fact that he could be no older than 10, yet he appears to be well trained in the hypocacy of the church. I can’t imagine that he knows better, yet many children like him are being led to destruction along with their parents or those that they follow.
Melvin,
Thank you so much for taking the stand against mess. I will say this to you, I thought I was the messed up one because I couldnt listen to any of these Preachers. I would wonder why can’t I listen to these guys, now I know why. My spirit would get agitated everytime I would try to watch one of them on the tube. I believe that I am Holy Spirit filled and He is the spirit of truth, and when lies surface He will expose it to use, we have to learn to not second guess Him.
I praise God for you and your heart to see His people set free from the chains of the evil one.
Was that Cashflow in the background on stage with the other pimps?
All I can say is Wow!! I have to admit I used to do the same thing by getting caught up in the emotionalism.
What’s pastor Jenkins qualifications?
Shalom to all,
Allllrighteeee then… wow!! Well, my sister called me and asked me why I left Bethany.com because she saw them on T.V. and…..
“THEY WERE DANCING AND REJOICING AND SHOUTING! I DON’T KNOW WHAT THEY TEACH BUT THAT’S HOW I WANT MY KIDS!”
Huh!? Saay Whaat!? She doesn’t know what they teach but she wants them to Dance and shout. I responded, “He’s (the pastor) is a thief who robs the poor”. That pretty much labled me as “without the Spirit” only head knowledge.
It’s only gonna get worse. The golden rule: If you dance and shout and give over and beyond. That’s a true church!!
I’m still waiting for the supporters of pimps to show me where in the Bible it recommends the poor give to get out of being earthly poor.
My Bible says that those with money should give to the poor.
The pimps have turned scripture on its head.
In the Bible the poor that went to a state of “no lack” got there by someone else giving or sharing to support them. Not by the poor person giving their last mite.
Silly man IC……..the “Widow’s Mite”. Sure, the Bible never actually SAYS that she got rich, BUT you gotta let the Spirit interpret that for ‘ya, dontchaknow.
I praise God(not like them though) more and more everytime I see this foolishness and thank HIM for delivering me from this insidiousness. Nothing against praising the Lord, but can we find any Biblical warrant for this type of junk? I mean yeah David praised the Lord but i don’t know…… I wonder sometimes if GOD is in any of these churches at all?
Personally, I didn’t have a “major” problem with the video till I noticed it was THE SERMON. I thought it was just some worship and praise portion of the service. But when I heard the guy speak to only get them jumping around for material again…MY PIMP ALERT FIRED.
I’m not one who feels folks should be so caught into emotion that they’re falling around and almost hurting others, but usually where people are allowed to get engrossed in emotion, the truth is slim. It seems where people allow themselves to get caught into emotion, they check their brains at the door.
If we are supposed to remain sober, I think we need to control our emotions a little.
Like Paul said, once we start doing stuff that to an outsider would make us appear to be mad, it’s probably a bad idea to be doing it.
I’m afraid that this may be over kill, but have anyone ever heard of the word “epitha”?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZn8Wc5rbfY
no I haven’t….what is it?
Hi TOG………not sure if you’re just being a bit sarcastic (imagine ME unable to be certain about sarcasm
) but I thought I’d answer it just in case.
He mispronounces the Aramaic word “Ephphatha” (Ehf-uh-thuh), meaning “Be opened”.
Mar 7:34 And looking up to heaven, he sighed, and saith unto him, Ephphatha, that is, Be opened.
What I find much more disturbing than the unlikely coupling of Ebonics and Aramaic though is his repeated assertion that God is SAYING this load of manure he’s preaching, and he’s just communicating it by revelation.
“GOD is saying “Turn the doorknob on your front door and the whole house will be turned up-side down.”
“God is saying “Before the year is over, I’m opening the (shut) doors to you.”
“There’s stuff God OWES YOU that’s been in storage. You weren’t s’posed to get it until ‘06, but if you shout “LOOSE” tonight (switching here to voice of God supposedly) “I’m gettin’ ready to give you some stuff early!!”
Not only is this an absolute BUTCHERY of Mat 8, it’s a blasphemous LIE that God said these things to Jamal. God promised to “turn the house up-side down” (for Jesus I presume) for everyone who turned the doorknob to their house??
God promised to open the doors that were shut for everyone there??
God keeps blessing in “storage”, but He’s going to let them go “early” for all those who shout “LOOSE”??
Jer 23:31 Behold, I [am] against the prophets, saith the LORD, that use their tongues, and say, He saith.
Jer 23:32 Behold, I [am] against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the LORD, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the LORD.
Jamal is absolutely playing with fire……..he has no regard for the Word. He treats Scripture like it’s Play-Doh, molding, stretching, and twisting it into whatever form he pleases. And if he has this little regard for the Word, he cannot possibly have any regard for its Author. (MN: Or God’s people. )
I’m BEGGING somebody to defend this pimp…….
Thanks Gary, honestly i never heard the word Ephphatha or “epitha”, my comment was out of both ignorance and sarcasm since he sounded so foolish in his preaching. Though i still find it remarkable that people will waste precious gas money and lose a good sleep on Sunday to watch this man preach. I’m all for fellowship, but i think people would serve better seaching for truth on their own than partaking in this mess. I mean really, if i’m going to give money and time to a ministry, at least let it be worth while! Some sinners could view this from the outside and discern that those like Jamal are false prophets. yet our saved-fire-batized-speakin in tongue brethern will give him the benefit of the doubt. How much proof do you need when he doesn’t even hide his intent?
Bro. Gary,
You are on it with Jeremiah 23. It is one of the signs of the end times.
Melvin, I didn’t know that you were scheduled to appear on standupministry.com. Could you provide the date and time that you are scheduled to interview, so i can catch it? The brothers there appear to be excited to have you, it sounds like it will be pretty good. I recently caught the interview with Steve Lumbley where they spoke about Joel Osteen which was excellent.
The interview is already posted in their archives. (April 12th show).
Thanks IC. I forgot to let folks know.
Since you seem interested, I will be doing another session on 26 April. This time it will be Ken and Gloria Copeland - I may pull Creflo into it while I’m at it.
very good, i will make note of it. BTW, could you remind us as the date approaches?
Thanks
Good grief Mel…………we didn’t hear about Avery until he was just short of graduating from college, now we missed one interview and would have missed 2 were it not for happenstance.
For shame………that’s what you get for not hiring your Armorbearer sooner to take care of the little stuff.
(MN: Okay - I’m trying’ to get in the Mand of Gawd mode like Stephen, the COGIC preacher. But I still have a hard time shamelessly tooting my own horn. )
HEHEHE!!!
Was this the entire sermon? Was this a particular interlude for something other than what I saw? I lived 5 blocks away from Greater Grace, and man, on a windy day you could hear them. Was the boy in the spirit?
This is flat out ridiculous! When are people going to wakeup and uncover the wool that has been put over there eyes? As many people that was in that sanctuary, somebody had to recognize this fraud. Furthermore, just imagine if truth and justice were being proclaimed to a multitude of that number (that was hungry), how much more powerful the Church could be. We must pray for the deceived. God Bless.
I realize that now in my 20 years of age the difference between now and when i was younger because i used to go to a church with my grandma(mom’s mother) and all they would do was shout(dance) every sunday and no preaching, a lot of yelling in the mic and music so loud you would leave with a headache and when it came time for the children and them shouting the preacher would always say don’t stop them because the bible says “suffer not little children to come unto me” and we would be gone we would go get our cousins and friends and hold hands and “tear that flo”!!! lol up and not be feeling a thing and i look at that young boy and i hope that it was genuine praise because i used to do the samething and make people think it was real but it wasn’t being acknowledged my God,then you would have the adults doing the same thing and as soon as service let out somebody about to fight or has an attitude about something . so when my grandma got sick and as i grew older it wasn’t the same and i would go to my other grandmother’s (dad’s mom)chuch and they didn’t do all that )shouting the entire service on the queing of music when they praise it was real and they didn’t need any music or somebody hypeing them up and i would sometime think of my Grandmother (mom’s mother) church and how I would hear people say if you go to a church that doesn’t believe in danceing then that means its a dry church and i had the mentality of if i went to a church and they didn’t dance during half of the service then hey thats a dry chruch
and as i started to attend my dad’s mother’s church i seen the difference and that was when I recived salvation and am truly saved santified and filled with the Holy Ghost and learned that the Holy Ghost is not a shout (dance). when the spirit of God has taken control you wont be able to sit still but you wont be on beat with the music either and you wont need any music oh how I thank God for the previlage of being in His Church The pillar and Ground of Truth “The church of God”
Hallelujah!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
I agree with you 100%. The church now is into emotionalism and hype, thats how the pimps can keep the followings they have because folk love hype and they love their flesh to be tickled. I really don’t blame the pimps, they would have no game if the saints weren’t so gullible. Read Rev. 13:16, and it will tell you why gullible folk will take the mark.
also i want to add that we continue to pray for those that are blinded and dont know truth and that God shows them truth and when he does that they accept it
In Jesus NAme!!!!!!!!
Family it is truly hard sometimes to believe that you once fell for this stuff and called it “having church”. What is truly difficult is that once we are out we still have to deal with the withdrawals. For instance, do any of you who have came out wonder what else that you experienced was false? Was it of Satan? What about the worry over the salvation of those who you once had full confidence in? What about worrying over your own salvation? What about the fear of being fooled again? So no one should be hard on themselves for once being bamboozled. We should just strive to be sober minded to not only keep from being caught up again but also so that we will be equipped to warn others. Just my take on it. By the way IC, maybe he was equating “crossing over” to dying and going to be with Jesus. Nah!!! LOL!!!
I agree Brother Lawrence. I was also saved in a church of like manner. I tarried for the Holy Ghost and spoke in tongues numerous times. I have even preached it before. Not only that. I debated with those who were Trinitarian and told them if they were not baptized in Jesus’ name and did not have the evidence of tongues then they were not saved. I spoke in tongues more than most folks and was good at it. I wonder what in the world was going on. As I have matured I realized that what you see is what you will become. This is evidenced in the inner city with kids doing what they saw their parents do. I always wondered why “white” kids always went to college and got good jobs. The reason was this is what they saw. This little poor fellow is only mimicing a culture that he was born in. He is a product of his environment. I also pray that this young man could be liberated from such behavior. So many churches are counter productive to biblical masculinity and we wonder why we see so many men with feminim bents.
hi mr. woods, just wondering- do you still speak in tongues, or do you believe the tongues you were speaking in was something you picked up and mimicked by being around that particular enviornment.
Nope, Nope, and more Nope! I do not I don’t believe that my past experience was from God either, but a learnt behavior. I think I was a product of my environment actually to give a little background. I stop faking and went to talk to my pastor about it and they told me I had a spirit (not the Holy one either) and that led to me leaving the church, joining the 5 percenters and hating Christianity. To make a long story short, God tore me a new one and I repented; however, over the past 8 years I have become more reformed in my Theology, and I hold to a more Calvinistic Cessationist Theology. Sorry if I implied otherwise.
Calvinistic Cessationist Theology? This board is probably not the appropriate place to discuss it (unless of course MN would like to start a new thread. Chances are, though that that thread would end up being as long as the OSAS thread, which by the way is my favorite thread. But, I digress…), but please email me. I would love to find out why you believe that miracles, etc have ceased. henry.thrower@erieinsurance.com
(MN: Actually, he didn’t say miracles have ceased. He said Tongues, as described and used in 1 Cor 12, 14 have ceased - in general. Remember, he didn’t say miracles have ceased. If you next comment is nattering on accusing him of saying miracles have ceased, count on not getting your comment published. I don’t want to go around in pointless circles. )
No need. I was just answering someones question. Not essential lets agree to disagree upfront Elder Hank
Good morning, Melvin. I keep hearing the statement that the tongues have ceased. Out of curiosity and clarity, is that in the Word anywhere? I would just like to know how to back that up. If you don’t want to answer this through the thread, please answer me through my email (trayjay.tamar@fuse.net). Thank you. (I’m not trying to start another thread.)
(MN: As a matter of fact, I am about half way through a paper I am writing for a denominational discussion on that very topic. Once I finish, I will likely post it in the essays section with the same rule as always: Read it through, no knee-jerk responses, defend your position on the basis of scripture, not experience. Address the issues raised in the paper. If you remind me, I will send you a copy before I post it on the site. )
Well, that was rather harsh, MN. did we not see that I excused our conversation from this board? Also, did we not see that I said tongues etc. (MN: You said “miracles”. That is, you asked why he believes God no longer performs miracles. And pardon the apparent harshness. I simply don’t want you to keep arguing about something that wasn’t siad. )
To Mr. Woods: I am always curious as to the why’s of others theology. I think that reasoned discussion sharpens us. The offer is still and always open for a one on one discussion should you decide to.
Here is my email. Elder Hank if you have any questions. I will tell you upfront that I am extremely skepitcal of most miracles today. Most seem to be subjective at best, and down right manipulative at worst. I am open on any questions never afraid to dialogue in love. I typically don’t debate non-essentials unless someone is dogmatic that their way is the correct way and there is no room for other perspectives.
http://www.lionelwoods@hotmail.com
woods-lionel@aramark.com
i hear you, mr. woods. i’ve had a similar experience. i was told to tarry for the Holy Ghost w/ the evidence of speaking in tongues. i was brought to an “upper room” and some newspaper was placed before me (in case i was purged-yuk!) i was told to say jesusjesusjesusjesus over and over again or hallelujah etc. until i was “filled”. i saw people frothing, and heard all kinds of weird sounds like clucking- i was so scared. i was thinking to myself, if this is getting the Holy Ghost, i don’t want it. that was when i was 15yrs. Old. i left feeling like i had somehow disappointed God because i didn’t let Him fill me.
i never went back to that church. many years later when i was part of a baptist/pentecostal assembly i was told to just believe God by faith for the tongues, and i know it was a learned behavior i picked up from being around tongue talkers. i can still do it w/ the simplest of ease if i wanted to (just like marjoe). it all sounds the same. i repented to God and no longer practice that deceptive behavior. i believe in the biblical tongues that were of the Holy Ghost on the day of pentecost. He gave them the ability to speak in actual languages they had never learned. the econdodobohiyah stuff (gee whiz, i can even spell it) i believe, is a counterfeit phenomenon. glossolalia is not THE defining evidence of the indwelling of the Holy Ghost. a life transformed into more Christlikeness, a renewed mind, a heart after Jesus, the fruit of the Spirit being evident in our lives, the genuine love of the brethren, the desire to obey Jesus and walk in the Spirit, and proclaiming the unadulterated truth of the Word of God are the marks of a Spirit-filled believer.
the babbling tongues, the jerking violently, falling out (so called slain) and flopping to the floor when some preacher touches you (or throws his jacket in your face ala benny hinn) barking like a dog, laughing like a hyena, snake handling, and poison drinking are all learned behaviors of being around an atmosphere of a false Christianity. but God is faithful. He knows how to reach His own and bring us out of whatever state we’re in. i don’t mean to offend anyone who still practices these things earnestly believing they’re from God- but they’re not. some of them are taking out of context from their biblical setting. (Acts 2:1-12, Mark 16:18, Luke 10:19, John 18:6)while the rest are just derivatives of man’s fertile imagination. unless i am mistaken- after joel’s prophecy was fulfilled, there are no other occurrences of the disciples being filled w/ the Holy Ghost w/ the evidence of tongues but rather with the evidence of boldness to speak the Word and being filled w/ joy. (Acts 4:29-31, Acts 13:52, Rom.15:13, 1Thess.1:6) sadly, these demonstrations of the flesh will continue to go on for tradition is indeed a stronghold. i am thankful that your eyes were opened and you were able to see it for what it is.
God Bless YOU Mrs Marv for revealing what i was afraid to. in my soul i knew that the tougues of today, is not the same as the one at the day of pentecost. it feels somehow forced and carnal rather then spritual and heavenly, but because of my church practices i hold my tougue (dont say anything) but please answer me this when it says praying in the Holy Ghost is that not talking about a form of tougues
I too had the same experience. I felt so used afterwards and I guess a little embarrassed that I allowed people to manipulate me, but hey I chalked it up as a learning experience and I usually will not discuss tongues unless someone says it is the evidence of the Holy Spirit in reference to salvation.
Thanks for asking him about the tongues. I was going to ask him until I saw your question. It amazes me on how many people are running around talking yab ba dab ba dooooo and don’t realize they aren’t saying anything. I talk to people almost all week trying to save them through God’s word on true tongue of beginning of church. Which was nothing more than what we could language. That being greek, spanish, german, etc. Just at that point they had different dialects of the few known languages back then. The answer is clear in Acts 2:8 and 1 Corin. 14 Only if the people of God would read and understand.
Melvin,
As a people (of african descent), do you think that we are saved? Or do you think that because Christianity was forced on us as slaves, we accepted it to stay alive, not because we honestly, truly, really believe? I question whether we believe in this faith because we don’t practice the tenets of this faith. We “used” it during slavery to survive, and “use” it now to manipulate the masses, for personal financial gain/to steal from the masses/to pimp the masses, etc…
Anonymous, I think your premise is flawed at its core. No one is saved “as a people” for one thing. You speak of African Americans as if they are a monolith. Some black folks are saved, some are not……..some white folks are saved, some are not. Simple as that.
Also, your question dismisses the fact that no one accepts or rejects Christ because it was either forced upon them culturally, or was native to them culturally. That is meaningless.
God works in the heart of the Elect, and the Elect respond to that work by accepting Christ. Man can neither force Christ upon you, nor keep you from Christ.
If some “used” Christianity to survive, that does not mean that in that use God did not open their eyes and bring them to Christ. For others, I’m sure it never went beyond “using” Christianity, and for those there never was salvation.
Nothing could be less important than the MANNER in which one finds Christ, because no one actually FINDS Christ anyway.
Christ finds YOU………….whether slave, or free, or in another culture. Christ has brought millions into a saving knowledge of Himself right in the midst of Africa. He also brought millions to faith in Himself while bringing Africans into a Christian culture.
The means are insignificant, and at His discretion. What matters is ELECTION. And if you are among the Elect in Christ, it matters not where or how He draws you.
GaryV, that was the perfect response!
The lineage of Christ and ancient Hebrew history would be a good place for you to start a study of the people who eventually became known as the Jews.
The Bible is the history of the world that includes all
nations.
Is it me or does it seem like these people have programs every single day. This is a church a friend of mine goes to. This church associates themselves with the pimps, they have games inside the church, entertaining stuff etc. Check, check, check it out http://www.jesushousedc.org/calendar/calendar.asp?ID=1
Well Boardman……….if you let the sheeple stay home, they might actually read the Bible for themselves, or even teach it to their children. Nothing could be worse for the pimps.
Gotta keep ‘em hoppin……..
Good old nigerian churches….got a program everyday…..RCCG are one of the biggest denominations originating from nigeria…got one on every corner here in London…got stories to tell about that church….most over spritual church i’ve ever encountered! (e.g praying that within 7 days, if the gang leaders in london don’t repent that God should kill them…..MADNESS!!)
You got to wonder what would Jesus think if He came into this type of frenzied “worship” service.
ANd to think that these pimps and pimpettes and pimpetting playing music players are duping the masses. All done becasue the masses do NOT want to study; they do NOT want to sit and meditate. They would rather go dance, shake, and get “slain in the spirit” ( I especially cannot stand that spiritual verbage aka garbage) then to sit learn of Jesus’ teachings, and follow what He said to do.
You website is just awesome!
Hmmm…….this video is good for an aerobic workout.
GaryV my question was to Melvin.
You are missing my point totally.
I posed the question because historically, Africans were not Christians. We were introduced to Christianity by White Racist European and American Slave Owners who forced Christianity on us and therefore Jesus was forced on us. In my opinion, we didn’t believe then - we had NO choice but to accept this forced religion or we were hung, body extremities cut off, burned, beaten/physically abused/mentally abused, women and children raped, women and children kidnapped from us, etc… (MN: I don’t think he did miss the point. What was historical does not effect your decision in the here and now. Thus the “confusion” about your statement. What I decide about Christ has nothing to do with what may have been done with my ancestors. My ancestors were introduced to Christianity for a number of reasons, some racist, some not. But that does not have anything to do with my decision to follow Christ. Christianity was not forced on YOU. It was not forced on ME, and it was not forced on anybody in the church I attend. A better question would be “Melvin, do you think the people who were forced to profess Jesus Christ as savior were saved?” Perhaps that is the question you were trying to ask. )
Also, in my opinion, we don’t believe today - it became a way of life passed down from slavery and generation to generation and we just went through the MOTIONS.
If we truly revered God (MN: Who said that those who exhibit the self-destructive behavior revere God? I’m saying quite the opposite. Their behavior defines where they stand on Christ. I don’t care how many times a rapper or hip hop person gets up and says “I thank Jesus Christ, my lord for this honor.” As long as their behavior contradicts that it means nothing. ), why is there so much self destruction in the black communities, why are there so many illegimate children, why do black men father babies and walk out on black women to raise them fatherless in poverty and ghettos and substandard educational systems, why do (MN: Some ) black men resort to a life of crime. (MN: Because they, like their White brethren, have a fallen nature. And if all they see is a pointlessly greedy Christianity, or a thoughtless, weak Christianity, they why should they not do what they do? )
It is as if African Americans are one extreme or the other. (MN: Not at all. Not any more so than others in society. I, for instance, am not rich, live in a regular house, am self-employed, raised for children (all of whom have attended or are attended college. My first grandchild was born to my first son five years after he was married, none of them have been in jail, none of them have children out of wedlock, none of them are on welfare. All of them have jobs. Two of them are married. One is engaged. One is in medical school. One is completing