I cleaned it up a little, but here’s a comment from a fellow who just couldn’t keep from commenting on the closed post about D/L in church. Remember, once a posting is closed to comments, you can always send me an e-mail. I will not POST your e-mail unless you give me permission. And your identity will not be revealed unless you give me permission. But I really wanted to put this comment up. Thus the individual posting. Feel free to comment as long as you can resist the urge to talk forever.
Here’s the comment:
For a while now I have been shamefully viewing this site. I’m just upset that while people are trying to get to the First Baptist homepage, they come here instead if they type .com instead of .org. I’m going to respond only once and I only have one thing to say about this issue about the music ministry you keeping talking about.
I have a “Life Application Bible (King James)” and as you know this bible has footnotes which break down the meanings of bible verses. What I am about to say (mostly from my bible. I’m not taking credit) sums up everything.
In the footnotes for 1Corinthians 6:9 and 6:11 the note says: “Paul was describing characteristics of unbelievers. He doesn’t mean that adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals, thieves, or greedy people are automatically excluded from heaven. Christians come from all backgrounds, including these. They may still struggle with evil desires, but they should not continue in these practices. In 6:11 Paul clearly stated that even those who sin in these ways can have their lives changed by Christ. However, those who say they are Christians but persist in these practices with NO remorse shall not inherit the Kingdom of God. Now unless somebody sees S. walking around switching, holding another man’s hand, or anybody else’s for that matter, you cant tell what’s in that person’s heart or whether or not they are truly trying to change.
If somebody is homosexual and wants help and repents for their sins the church is the right place for them. Nobody at First Baptist embraces that lifestyle openly in service, if they did they would addressed by Pastor Jenkins. He or she who is struggling with these evil desires must understand their sins and should not continue their ways with no remorse. For if they do God will hand them over. Romans 1:27-28 NOBODY (except GOD) really knows what’s going on in these people’s personal lives. So SHUT it about not liking whoever in the music ministry because GOSSIP is a sin as well.
I couldn’t have said it better myself.
hey Melvin,
Do you still attend First Baptist? If you do, why?
I am in agreement that if you are not going to teach the word un compromising and true then you should not teach it at all, however if indeed GOD has revealed to you that there are somethings that are not right it was for one of two reasons or both.
1) to Pray and intercede for deliverance at your ministry
2) to leave
However GOD did not reveal this information for you to tear down the leader that “GOD” has chosen. Remember he was still chosen by GOD and if he lacks the strength to deal with certain things in the ministry then he needs prayer not criticism. Please remember what happened to Miriam and Aaron when they talked against Moses for doing what they didnt think was right(Numbers 12:1 - 15). GOD judged them quickly and it was MOSES the same man that they attacked and criticized that prayed for their deliverance.
I can appluade your zeal for wanting to have the “truth” revealed however I believe you may be going about it the wrong way.
Be Blessed. BTW ( I dont think I talked forever hahaha)
Just Wondering,
Let’s start with the reference to Moses. I commend you for using the Bible in your comment. Sadly, this has been very rare among most of the commenters. However, I would ask that you consider the following in your use of the reference:
1. Aaron and Miriam didn’t speak against Moses for doctrinal reasons. They spoke against him because he married the Cushite woman. In order to be at least somewhat applicable, I would have to be criticizing John becasuse of the woman he married, or the way he dresses, or some other purely peripheral matter. I have conciously and purposely avoided any such complaint. (except for the article about him and Trina looking like a prince and princess out of Africa). But my objections are not peripheral. They are central to the very Gospel itself.
2. In Deuteronomy 13:1-11 God tells the Israelites what to do if someone tries to feed them bad doctrine. Romans, Galatians, 2 Timothy and others tell us what to do if someone tries to feed US bad doctrine. Look at the page “Why This Site is Here”. Click on the link and your browser should take you right there.
I did leave First Baptist, around four years ago. I haven’t regretted a single day of being gone.
If you can show me where the Bible says I am to “pray and intercede for deliverance at your ministry,” I would be most grateful.
You’re right. You didn’t talk forever. You didn’t have to. YOU actually used the Scriptures. Again, I commend you.
Melvin
A response to the initial comment for this section:
Yea right! This respondent sounds like one of S’s groupies or supporters…..His comments reflect naiveness and a lack of discernment…..I hope he’s not a minister!
1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is not relevant to someone having “remorse”…. At the end, God’s not gonna look to see if a person had remorse for their sins. Either they lived right or they’ll end up in hell. (see Matthew 7:21-23) The “once saved always saved” doctrine is a FALSE doctrine. (Luke 13:3; Hebrews 5:9)
Additionally, God’s word should be the basis for our conclusions:
“But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.” (James 1:22)
“……The body is not meant for sexual immorality,….” NIV(1 Cor. 6:13)
“But those who are outside (the church) God judges. Therefore put away from yourselves the evil person (inside the church).” (1 Cor. 5:13) This refers to sexually immoral persons.
“Preach the word……CORRECT, rebuke, and encourage……..” NIV (2 Tim. 4:2) Correction takes place when action occurs to fix or rectify a situation. A preacher should “enforce” what he/she preaches. You’re not enforcing God’s word when you have fornicators singing in the choir or homosexuals playing the keybroad, directing the choir, leading Praise & Worship, etc., etc.
“My brethren, let not many of you become teachers, knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgment.” (James 3:1)
“For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?” (1 Peter 4:17)
In summary, both of you should “shut up”! The “all knowing” God knows what S. is really about. God knows who’s to blame for allowing him to be in ministry. Maybe if you weren’t so “carnal” you could accurately discern what’s been going on at FBCG. (1 Cor. 2:14)
Here’s the bottom line: God is not pleased and He will deal with the leadership at FBCG. God’s gonna shut-up S.H. unless he repents!
…………………………………………an FBCG member
Not bad. I don’t agree with the position on “Once Saved Always Saved,” but I can work with it.
It’s good to see you actually using Scripture and generally using it accurately.
Just one thing: Why are you still at FBCG, especially if you have such “violent” disgreements with their positions and practices? They are, afterall, a OSAS kind of place.
James, drop me a line. I wouldn’t mind discussing your position with you. I’m at mjones@pulpit-pimps.org. But you know that.
Melvin Jones
I totally agree with the scripture based comments and other comments of James. My eyes were already opened to the “errors” at FBCG. What the others said about a certain person was not “gossip”; It’s truth. But I wasn’t lead to speak out about it.
After seeking advice from other ministers (including pastors), I was told not to leave. They assured me that God placed me there for a reason. I was instructed to intercede and wait until God was ready for me to leave. I’d encourage James to do the same.
Also, the ministers told me not to bother saying anything to the leaders because they should have known better. They spent all that time studying the word and taking classes, but they failed to adhere to “all” of it. You know how saints tend to treat the Bible like a “buffet table”. They pick and choose what they want to preach and live by, right? Obviously, that’s what the FBCG leadership had been doing.
Around last Oct/Nov., there was a bible study session that taught against judgment and public exposure. I hope you don’t mind my personal opinion: If an individual is a “public” figure doing wrong, they deserve to be publicly exposed. In the Old Testament, God used his Prophets to expose and relay words of judgment quite often. David was exposed after sinning with Bathsheba. Jesus didn’t go behind closed doors during his exposures and rebukes. (Matthew 23)
Regarding exposure, the word of God makes it clear that it is His will for sinners to be EXPOSED:
“But if you fail to do this, you will be sinning against the LORD; and you may be sure that your sin will find you out.” –Number 32:23–
“For nothing is secret that will not be revealed, nor anything hidden that will not be known and come to light.” -,Luke 8:17–
Exposure and open rebukes serve as a warning to let others know: God means what He said, and He’s not playing with anybody. see 1 Timothy 5:19-20 see NIV
Melvin, what does “OSAS” mean?
Melvin’s Note: Once Saved Always Saved. Thanks for asking.
I like the NKJV better:
“For nothing is secret that will not be revealed, nor anything hidden that will not be known and come to light.” –Numbers 32:23–
By the way Cindy, your statement was not simply your personal opinion. If that’s what the Bible says, that’s what it says.
Romans says draw attention to those… Jude says we are to contend with them. Other places talk about publicly addressing their errors.
You people are on a roll. I think this is three or comments ina row actually using Scripture. This is outstanding.
Melvin (happy as a pig in mud) Jones
AMEN Cindy!