I got my weekly Kerney fix. Kerney Thomas sent me the cheap “Bible Red Blood of Jesus Handkerchief” a couple of weeks ago. Here’s a picture. He let me know in that letter that he was just lending me his personal handkerchief.
This week he promised to remove the generational curse from my life if I send him some money. All I have to do is sleep with the page I have pictured above, and send it in, along with any amount of money that has a 7 in it, like $37, $77, $777, or anything larger than that. If I do that, he will anoint the page with oil and place it on his altar. He’ll keep it there for seven days while he prays for me.
Do understand that the only difference between this jackal and Ken Copeland is Ken Copeland flies a business jet and people now send money into him WITHOUT his having to ask for it very much.
Kerney is so incredibly bold with his scam. Listen to some of what he says:
” I feel led to send you this Number 7 Prayer Page. This is for God to reverse the curse back to 7 generations…” (Page 3)
or: ” I’m telling you there is such a powerful PROPHETIC ANOINTING on me right now and I know that THIS IS YOUR TIME…” (the emphasis is in the original). (Page 1)
“And when God lifts the curse off of your money, MONEY IS GOING TO BEGIN TO FLOW LIKE A RIVER TO YOU .” (Page 1)
“Wait a minute. I hear a voice saying: “I’M GOING TO DESTROY THE GENERATIONAL CURSE OFF OF Melvin’s HOME…MIND…BODY…AND MONEY.” (Page 1)
You have to wonder if the money had a curse on it before it ended up in my billfolder. But I digress.
Can you imagine the person who hasn’t much of anything all their life, trying to trust God and getting something like this:
“He’s giving you another opportunity to get your bills paid. He’s giving you another opportunity to be blessed as you go in…blessed as you come out…and even to have enough money left over so that you can get some of the things you’ve been dreaming about, and do some of the things that you would liked to do.”
What are they going to do? Go digging in their already threadbare pockets and send the pimp their money, trusting that God will give them some money.
Interestingly, the letter I got a couple of weeks ago said that he “…feel(s) God is changing your season from one of lack to one of abundance.” I guess when he was having his visions, he just kind of missed that pesky generational curse sitting out there making me miserable.
Oh well, at least I got the Bible Red Blood of Jesus Handkershief. I don’t know what I would have done without that.
She implied the...
I think I just threw up a little bit.
sleeping with the page???? this kinda sounds like the same advice the local heberalist/witchdoctor would give to a very naive client.
i really don’t understand how people get caught up in this. its clearly not biblical. and just a thought why is money the only ‘curse’ these ‘prophets’ wanna help u lift.
‘Cause they don’t want you to send them some of your back ache?
Did he say that the curse would reverse back 7 generations? That’s worth it!!! Maybe God gave him a “Holy Ghost Flux Capacitor” that goes back in time. Does that mean I would get all the moeny that my Dad lost on horse racing in the 1970’s back??? What a great blessing!!!! Maybe my great great (7 times) grandfather lost money, and now I can get that back too!! Sign me up!!
GREAT comment!!
The audacity of some people.
I may start crying…seriously.
I’ve seen this clown in action. This is Rev. Ike all over again. Oh yeah, Rev. Ike is still is business after all these years.
All this is stuff is nothing new because their ancestors, meaning the preachers back in the day (Ewing, who was investgated by the FBI, Pofoff, W.V Grant and all the others orginated the prayer cloth) done the same exact thing these young bucks are doing.
But they are using the media and being sophticated..
what kills me is that he has the nerve to say that this is just an ordinary cloth until he prays over it. and the reason why he chose cloth is because it can soak up prayer. so once he prays over the cloth and it soaks up his prayer then it is only then a holy colth. i used to feel sorry for people who fall for that nonsense, but dont they read their bible for themselves? when are folks going to learn you dont need to pay for prayer…
Out of all the hucksters out there this buster really cracks me up. His handkerchief ministry is base from Acts 19:12 and the scripture is taken so out of context it makes me holler.
If you read the passage from verse 8 you see Paul preaching, he’s even arguing to persuade unbelievers about the kingdom of God. They didn’t believe so God allowed miracles to happen just to verify that the message Paul preached was from God. And the miracle was that people were being healed when they touched a handkerchief that had previously touched Paul’s skin. People benefited from the miracle, but the primary benefit was that the miracle proved that Paul was preaching a message from God.
This is not a passage of scripture that is meant to teach that this practice should be done. Prayer is not mentioned. Although, it may be safe to assume that some people may have prayed but it’s not recorded. So the idea of a “prayer handkerchief” is not even mentioned in the Bible. You definitely don’t see the apostle Paul asking for financial contributions. People may or may not have given, but he wasn’t asking for them to send money as he sent out a “point of contact.”
Some of the things that come from the book of Acts aren’t normative nor should they be used as a pattern for us to follow today.
You know a lot of times, we see some of the same stuff in the local churches but brush it off b/c it’s your Church. I heard a message today that said that we need to give give give until it hurts and we will be blessed, in addition to not paying tithes may send you to hell. I am all for tithing, but shouldnt at least some of the money that we give go toward helping someone and spreading the message of the gospel? Most preachers tell you that if you question giving in any way, its b/c you don’t want to give. What is a person to do??????
HOW COME 1 THIRD OF THE TITHES DON’T GO TO THE WIDOWS LIKE THEY ARE SUPPOSE TO?
MARY: Could be because there aren’t any widows 60 yrs. old and older in the congregation (1 Timothy 5:9). But this is “not known” to the thieving “priests” behind the bull pits.
You asked what a person is suppost to do. Well as far as giving goes, give to those that truly are in need (the poor). If you in fact truely see what Jesus did in the Bible, He did just that. Jesus gave to the poor. He turned to the rich and told them to give what they had away also to the poor. Jesus was are perfect example and we are to follow after what He did and told us to do. Be a cheerful giver and give what you can to the poor.
I too believe that if we see someone we know having a financial hard time, we should help them as part of out tithe. After all what are we to eachother if we are not willing to help someone in our own back yard.I get so upset hearing how “we” send so much money everywhere else,yet I could go to any getto and find someone who is hungry, poor, with alot less than I have, it seems like it never ends.
FIRST off you should never be pressured to give, pressure giving is exacting and does nothing in the spiritual realm. Look at Matthew 25:31-45
It tells you what God calls his store house and what you should be supporting with tithes and offerings. It does not mention ANY church, and person, or others everyone seems to be bucket plunking in.
Follow the Word’s directions then you shall have good success. Stop following these idiot preachers that are fleecing you dry. No tithe or gift is counted in heaven if not “scripturally given” Preachers hate this truth being known Some might have to get a job if the Christian wise up.
I love to watch “Reverend Thomas” in the morning after I have had a long night at work. I just laugh myself straight to sleep……this man is crazy…..so is the “olive oil soap” man.
What we must remember is that all of this has been told to us in the Bible. We are warned of those who will “come in the name of the Lord” and perform miracles.
But this “handkerchief” thing is truly crazy. Have you all really been paying attention to the Kerney Thomas braodcast. Isn’t that a different lady sitting with him?
Back to the “olive oil soap”. Watch closely when the lady with the heavy accent is talking. At the end of her “testimony” the entire “congregation” LAUGHS…..
OH FATHER GOD…….this whole world is mad!!!!!
Sabba, e-dabba, mee-ko, ah-cole-lah, GAAAAAAAAAAAAWD! MMMM, IT JUST TOUCHES YUH; GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWD! MMMM, IT JUST TOUCHES YUH. Not sure what this doofus Kerney says right before he shrieks GAAAAAAAAAAAWD! like an angry chimpanzee! This moron has been fully debunked, chewed up and spit out. Can you shriek FRAAAAAAAAAAAAUD Mr. Kerney?!
I like watching Pastor Kerney Thomas Is Cracks Me up early morings on BET. I got a chance to see him in person at a Church in Richmond , Va . And it said the same stuff. He is a Fraud He dosing evan repect folks that are Crazzy enough to give him money He got kind of mad when a old lady in the church brought him some prayer requst, and told her ok mother with a sad look on his face I saw Right though it , he was just mad because the envlope Did not have money in it, Just pray Requst . You a 100% Right Kerney Thomas is a FraaaaaaaD!
Yes, I sit up at night after work and look at this clown and just laugh. Did anyone see it one night he prayed for this lady and told her God was removing her pain, He then yelled and said “did you feel that? I felt that when God removed your pain, did you feel it”? The caller said “no”. These pastors should stop their foolishness, they really make true men and women of God look BAD
I LOVE KERNEY THOMAS!!! HALALA BO CO SHAAAA WOMAN!!! BECAUUUUUSE GOOOOOOOOAAAAWWWDDD!! IS GONNA WORK YOU A MIWACLE. Thanka Jeeeeeesus.
Wow. Pamela, Rashunda, Nick, & Anonymous….you four had me in stitches concerning your comments about Kerney Thomas.
Thanks for the humor.
im with you on that one,Gridiron.
I was watching Evangelist Thomas last Saturday and on that segment, he supposedly healed a woman from pain that she had been having in her chest by touching her breast and making her fall out. Then, he told the congregation, “You all ought to wave your hands in the air…and wave ‘em like you just don’t care.”
I think that I have seen and heard it all. Headolow bo ko sha!
….”Touched her breast”…(?!?!)
For a man to even ensenuate this is action alone is absurd. A woman’s BREAST he touched? Crazy.
It looks like evangelist Thomas took that song “Rapper’s Delight and made it to “Pimp’s Delight”.
Doesn’t New Testament Scripture teach that the “curse of the generations” was broken at the cross? These preachers really like to milk that one!
Rev Kerney THOMAS: God Blessing, I give thirty seven dollar and fifteen years ago my credit it’s so bad and I need pay $45,000 and I put the number #7 down my pillow and three day’s my credit it’s clean the glory it’s only to the GOD
5-8-07
the glory it’s only the GOD he save my life and break the chain
I’m glad people comment on some of this stuff I never saw previously here. Just insanity.
Viper I tell you, a viper!
It reminds me of the newsletter TBN sent out to prep the masses for their recent Pimp-a-thon.
See the part that says:
Maybe next time Paul Crouch should send a handkerchief with the newsletter?
Marta………..then you’ve stolen $45,000. Your creditors didn’t forgive the debt. If you ask them today if they want their money, they will say “Yes.”
So what you’re saying is that God made a way for you to defraud institutions who lent you money??
Errrrrrrrrr…………OK.
GaryV, I’ve seen that sort of “testimony” several times. It’s what I call the the bank makes error in your favor move. Only it’s the kind of “blessing” that is rooted in deception. When I was at Eddie Long’s club it was the kind of thing that would get the entire place shouting, with the exception of people like myself that were like, WHAT??!!! Eddie Long was going with it though and claiming their testimony was proof of people giving (to him) and having debt canceled.
Such supposed “blessings” don’t actually pay the debt as a good steward would. It’s not someone receiving money to pay their debts. It’s a matter of debt supposedly just disappearing like magic. That would mean God is out hacking computers on Christian’s behalf
.
I think these folks that say these things eventually learn the truth later on, assuming they are not up to something they are not telling us about. I mean if they all are making it up for the pimp it wouldn’t be the first time such has happened.
There are biblical instances of debt being forgiven or lowered by the creditor because they feel compassion for the debtor. There are instances of the debtor receiving money to meet their needs, which the apostles did with regularity. All the pimps who cry out verses from 2 Corinthians 9 always forget to mention that giving was done to help saints who were in need. Pimps act like it was being given to Paul to buy a chariot.
And I forgot to add, Eddie Long would actually put up these bank makes error in your favor claims for all to hear. I mean, they would contact Fast Eddie privately with their story and he at times asked them to stand up in service and tell their story.
It was not like they stood up saying this out of the clear blue and Eddie just ran with it. It was all arranged! I saw a guy say his mortgage was canceled. He claims that he called the bank one day and they told him they could not find any record of his mortgage.
Eddie Long was able to use this to promote his scams to get people to give him money. Things like his Passover scam and such.
It was not uncommon to hear a phrase like “God is canceling mortgages”.
Such nonsense.
Yeah…………….a real PIMPIN’ chariot, with leopard skin upholstery, spinners on the wheels, diamond dust paint, and fuzzy Urim and Thummin hangin’ from the roof.
I’ve seen Kerney Thomas on the Word Network. That guy screams a lot while his pretty wife sits there. Does that stuff he offers really work? Just kidding. Enough said.
GAWDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD!!! u feel that?? u feel better!? don’t be playin me now…
UNBELIEVABLE! My husband and I received the EXACT same thing from Paul Lewis a couple of weeks ago!! I swear some factory iis churning out the same stuff for different pimps!!!
Pastor Kerney is a man of God. And if he isn’t that is between him and his God. But people testify to being
healed.
Yes they are healed, but because of THEIR faith and not because of a handkerchief. Also we should keep in mind why people use tangible effects to inspire faith. We are sensual beings that have a need for tangible anchors. People often buy those cloths, pages and what not because they feel they need a tangible anchor to hold down their belief in the miracles of God. That is the reason why those things are offered in the first place. True enough, God understands the human condition and the need for tangible proof of his promises and the so called “Pimps” too many times exploit that need.
Wrong, if Kerney ISN’T a man of God, that’s ALSO between him and the CHURCH because he broadcasts his nonsense to the whole world and makes the church a laughingstock.
Lots of folks claim to be healed by Benny Hinn as well……….just before they die with their last penny in Benny’s pockets.
I dont believe this guy!!!! I believe he is a fraud…. Gosh what happen to people fearing the Lord?
How can you all talk about the anointed Kerney, he is just trying to make mon….. save souls.
if pastor kerney is a fraud he should be left to answer to God and not us.
(MN: No one is trying to make him answer to us. We are trying to warn people like you away from him. Is the man who informs on a drug dealer trying to make the drug dealer answer to him? Certainly not. He is trying to warn people about the drug dealer. Does the state that notifies a community that a child molester lives among them trying to make the molester “answer to them”? No. They are warning the community. If you love the Christians around you, and if you are interested in obeying the Bible, you would warn them too. )
We know that there is a God and must keep our FAITH in him, if pastor kerney is making a mockery out of him he will suffer the consequence of his acts.
(MN: I show you my faith by my works (James 2:18) [this site, the research, the correspondence]. How are you showing your faith when you insist on simply sitting there and saying nothing, sitting in church and playing at being a Christian? I find your brand of Christianity to be completely worthless. )
I am disgusted by kerney thomas with his claims that he is a healer. He looks like a fat devil sitting there on the television screen. He should be run out of town for swindling people out of their money. If this offends anyone i’m sorry, because GGAAAAAAAAAAAAAWD is telling me,”He’s a fraud.
B.E.T IS A SCAM
AM SURPRISED THAT THIS GUY ISN’T IN JAIL… AM SURPRISED THAT B.E.T STILL RUNS THIS SCAM… B.E.T = BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION…
I THINK NOT. I THINK B.E.T IS MORE LIKE A BLOOD SUCKER OF THE BLACK & LATINO CULTURE… THERE SHOW’S ARE MOSTLY PRO-JAIL, PRO- GANGS, PRO-VIOLENCE FACTS: CHECK ALL THE MOVIES AND SHOW’S THE FEATURE ON A WEEKLY BASIS. IF ANY ONE TRIES TO CHALLENGE THEM THEY’LL GET DEFENSIVE LIKE KANYE WEST AND SAY IT’S A RACIST ACT ON MY PART TO BE A CRITIC TO THEM.. BUT IN THIS CASE AM ALSO A MINORITY (LATINO/BLACK) LOL
this is for all the jealous people out there. leave pastor kerney along, and let God deal with him. if you don’t like what he does just don’t watch him.i think he’s a beautiful person and a godly person to all the people with sense
Unknown……….what precisely does Kerney have that would make us jealous??
His ability to screech like a Charismatic Tarzan ?? While this is pretty cool, I don’t necessarily covet it.
B.E.T helps him scam people… so b.e.t it’s at fault also for this non sense. I feel sorry for people whom actually fall for this guy
Is is just me, does anyone else see a resemblance between Kerney and O.J.?
OJ murders people, Kerney murders Scripture.
You sure is was not OJ’s son Jason? If OJ murdered Ron and Ron was fighting for his life. Where were the marks on OJ? Anyway I digress.
But has anyone seen the press conference of Bishop Weeks? WOW, Juanita seems to have needed anger management. if what he is saying is true, this should be the trial of the century with a church setting. See how I brought this back to OJ?
P.S Why was the bellman “John” wanting to fight Bishop Weeks to a point where he actually challenged him? And if Bishop Weeks did not know John, How did Juanita know his name? Hmmm.
(MN: These people are insane. It’s entertainment for me. I just worry about the sheeple who get discouraged or force themselves to stupidly follow these pimps. )
OJ had a gash on his hand when he returned from Chicago. Bynum had injuries after her encounter with Weeks (see how I brought this back to Juanita?? LOL!!!).
Seriously, I’m with Mel. It’s a circus, and I think it’s GOOD for the sheeple to see their idols torn down.
Sad thing though is that even this won’t deter some of their followers. In a nutshell, their hearts are also filled with greed and not after the things of the Kingdom.
Aljonathan said,
“P.S Why was the bellman “John” wanting to fight Bishop Weeks to a point where he actually challenged him? And if Bishop Weeks did not know John, How did Juanita know his name? Hmmm.”
Aljonathan,
The truth is that Bellmen John was angry with Weeks because Bishop Weeks took the last bagel on the free continental breakfast. Trust me. I have no proof but I got insider info.
Kyle
OJ is in trouble again. They are really trying to nail this guy. To comment on the Weeks-Bynum drama, I agree with Melvin that it’s church entertainment at the expense of the lost.
I had almost forgotten about this case until recently. Then I see the press conference and say, JB probably should call this thing off. Both of them need to just work this out because they have brought a measure of shame to the gospel.
I don’t think OJ getting caught hiring dudes to flash guns at people to get back his memorabilia and getting caught at it constitutes the authorities “trying to nail him”.
I’m beginning to think, after the book thing and this new stuoidity, that OJ’s guilty conscience over getting away with murder is driving him subconsciously to get nailed.
This whole Bynum/Weeks thing is crazy. I in know way advocate a man putting his hands on a woman or a woman putting her hands on a man. However, it seems to me that JB is a control freak. You can’t be a true christian and want to maintain total control at all times. I believe the part about alot of people being in their business. Alot of people esteem JB very highly and desires a piece of her “annointing”. It’s a shame that this mess is being played out in the media where the world is watching.
Speaking of so-called financial miracles, once I heard Juanita Bynam tell this story: She went to an ATM and claimed God told her to ask for more money than was in her account and the ATM gave it to her. She considered the extra money to be a “blessing from God”, but an honest person would have informed the bank that its ATM machine had made an error and she would have given the extra money back to the bank. She didn’t seem to realize that in telling this story that she had just admitted to being dishonest and in effect stealing from the bank.
Gary V, I haven’t kept up with OJ since the murder trial. However, I agree if he’s guilt, then he would have to deal with it in his consciece.
I agree that OJ does not know Christ. I agree that instead of the pack of charlatans that have known him, he needs one of you to go speak with him about Christ. I agree you can also speak to his lawyers who probably don’t know Christ, the arresting officers who might not know Christ, the judge who might not know Christ and the stenographer who might not know Christ either. And don’t forget OJ’s son who might be the double murderer, given for some unknown reason police stopped all investigation into Jason before that was completed. Jason needs to be told about Christ too.
Hey, somebody had to keep this place from turning into my blog
. And I don’t even spend much if any time on OJ there 
.
What else is in the news, Kanye West? His mother’s death while tragic shows that all the money really means nothing. Even if he gave all that money back, he can’t have his mother back now. Money, vanity, he can have it, he’s watched his mother die because of it. I’ll keep Christ in truth instead of as a name to game with. I only mention him here because he claims the Lord’s name and we know his fruit proves him FALSE. Just like Snoop Dogg.
OK, now that we’ve covered the news of the day, let’s get back to the focus here, Christ. I’m trying to joke with you guys, but I hate when sidebars here get off into things very far from anything to do with this blog’s purpose.
(MN: Sometimes sidebars lead in some useful directions. Be patient. )
To IC, Kanye’s mother died because it was decreed for her to die. Money and vanity had nothing to do with it.
Anonymous, try entering a name. The point is that the pursuit of vanity was the means by which she died. Funded by the money her son has rolled in off garbage.
Women not getting plastic surgery just happen to seem less likely to get that decree to die at such an early age. Sort of like the kids who always drive an average speed of 100MPH versus the kids who don’t. Interesting how God so often decrees people to die in patterns like that!
I’m glad my mother told me to cut that garbage off when I was young.
Call me crazy, but it seems 1 Timothy 2:8-10 works better than trying to be a big named trash rapper.
IC, I’m the anonymous. I forgot to enter my name the last time. Please don’t think I didn’t want you to know it was me. 1 Timothy 2:8-10 dosn’t apply to Kanyes’ mother because she wasn’t a christian. Either God is in control of when we die or not. She died because her time was up. People have plastic surgery all the time and don’t die. People speed all the time and don’t die. Some do and some don’t. If your time is up, it doesn’t matter what the cause is!
DTG, perhaps you missed it, but Kanye West claims the Lord Jesus walks with him and prostitutes. They’ll be having a rather large funeral for his mother at a church building. These people claim to be saints. We know the fruit shows otherwise, but still, they claim to be “inside”, so I see no problem referencing scripture in their regard. Really it just shows there is a problem with what they claim versus what they do when looking at scripture.
You seem to have a view that is strictly about when someone is to die without noticing what is occurring during the life. Yes God has a time for us all, but HE KNOWS our own actions will perfectly play out how and when that occurs. Not only is our “time” known by God, but how and who is His child as well, including every action we all will make. Now, as I’ve said before, there just happens to be many young Black men dying in streets every night, some will die tonight as well, because of shooting at each other. Plenty of Jewish kids will be sitting at home not shooting at each other and less of them percentage wise will die tonight. Yes, God has a time for us all and it’s pretty obvious how that plays out for each of us. If things for someone were “different”, that is not simply a hypothetical you can apply to their actions without speculating if perhaps their “time” would have been “different” as ordained by God as well. If you want to claim “her time”, you’ve got to also claim “her actions” and all else with that. Ephesians 6:1-3 is in scripture for a reason.
Louis Farrakhan is not dead yet. He’s pretty evil. But for him he gets a longer life. Those kids shooting each other don’t and people getting cut up for the sake of vanity run a higher risk than someone who never has it done, but otherwise lived the same life. Surgery just seems to result in people with average higher risk for death than others. God just has it that way.
If I jumped off a bridge today and died, it might be my time and with that God knew I’d do something like that and set my time accordingly.
To I.C. let me give you credit on you using church building, nice to see lol.
I just want to tell you I don’t care what Mr. West says about Jesus walking with him. So what. It’s another Jesus, that’s for sure! That’s their thing, we can’t stop them sir. All it will do is frustrate you. I pay it no mind because I know they’re not talking about the God of the bible.
ic, i’m not understanding your callous and insensitive comments concerning donda west. she had cosmetic surgery, big deal. having plastic surgery may be vain-so what? so is dyeing our gray hair, painting our nails, whitening our teeth,wearing cologne/perfume etc. etc.
what if your wife has reconstructive surgery after having a mastectomy and she dies a few days later; would you say she was being vain for wanting to improve her appearance? a face lift, tummy tuck, breast augmentation ( i suppose even some Christian men wouldn’t mind their wives doing that one) gastric by-pass surgery to lose weight, whatever it is, is between them and God and we shouldn’t pass judgment about why they did it. all surgery is risky. plastic surgery is not my thing but if someone else wants to do it, be it saint or sinner- fine by me.
Hi mrs. maverick,
I don’t wish the woman died, I’m saddened by it. I’m saddened that people are going to these extremes for the sake of appearance. She did not have this done because of some medical procedure like a mastectomy. She didn’t have it done because she was unhealthily overweight, unlike gastric by-pass surgery. This was a highly elective surgery.
My point is, IS THE MONEY WORTH IT?
He’s become a trash kingpin. For what? Money, fame? Now his mother is dead because of the trappings that come with fame. Excessive cosmetic surgery.
As I’ve said, I only mention them because of the claim of them being the Lord’s. A claim K. West made on his own.
If it was a bad idea when Juanita Bynum did it than I’m a hypocrite if I agree with you in this case.
I stand on 1 Peter 3:3-6 and given they claim the Lord I apply it to them. They don’t claim to be outside, so I looked at it for a moment from an inside perspective. Regarding who to be judgmental about, I think 1 Corinthians 5:12 makes it clear.
I’m not trying to berate his mother, but I am warning saints to consider being happy as they are.
I’m not saying you’re going to hell for a tummy tuck, but the chase of vanity fails to uphold a godly standard for ones self.
Going to get surgery is an extreme far beyond hair dying, however for the record I never intend to dye my hair. I’ll let the gray hair come and thank God for it.
I’ve given my take, but here’s another:
What does the Bible say about a Christian having plastic / cosmetic surgery?
It’s about time saints stopped playing the role of pawns, feeding the greed of doctors that play on simple vanity.
Maybe he is out of line with his antics but you cannot prove it had anything to do with his mother, financially or spiritually. (MN: And I don’t believe anyone is saying to that effect. All I can say is that his mother died, apparently as a result of complications from a plastic surgery procedure. )
The woman was highly educated and former head of the English department at Chicago State University. Thus, she was educated and could have had this surgery whether or not her son was famous. In other words, the sista probably had enough money to pay for her own surgery; we’re not talking someone who was “uncredentialed” and broke…
Secondly, ordinary people with little money do it all the time, just look around, most insurances cover it. I have friends and family that work in one of QVC’s warehouses in Suffolk, VA. I think the highest amount that the average worker can make is around 15/hr–which amounts to about 30,000 per year. Out of that bunch, I can personally name 7 people that I know weren’t “rich” who had the surgery.
I have said all this to say that the type of surgeries (tummy tucks and breast reductions) she had are both easily accessible and affordable.
And BTW, don’t be so quick to say this type of surgery is elective unless you have access to medical records. My sister, at the age of 32, is very overweight and her doctor has suggested that she have it. It is important to note that she does not make a lot of money but her insurance will cover 80% of the overall cost. So, as a single mother with three children, it is a viable option for her.
I never had a problem with weight at 135 and 5′2′, but I hear a lot of conversation among women and I think this is a personal choice. In like manner, I don’t think they should have to explain why they choose this option, whether it is medically necessary or not
Righter in defense of vanity said:
And don’t you think that makes it even more sad that she would endorse the garbage produced by her son, by standing with him in public appearances?
Not many former English department heads seek out plastic surgery, but when their son is a big name celebrity they seem to.
Righter, I won’t address any more of your comment, because it’s a promotion for vanity and out of line with 1 Peter 3:3-6.
The surgery performed had nothing to do with weight.
Thanks for the reply.
This issue that she endorsed her son had nothing to do with her death. Having an English degree does not mean she was saved so I fail to see the connection here.
How many is not many IC? (English professors) Or better yet–how many do and how many dont?
My point is that she has made enough money to pay for her own surgery and I just don’t think it’s fair to say that Kanye paid for it with allowing acces to PHI–protected health information and billing
Her surgery may have not had anything to do with her son
(MN: Let me put a stop to this now. No one is saying her death was because of her son. No one is saying she couldn’t have afforded the operation without her son. Even if she couldn’t have afforded it, no one is saying she died because her son had money. No one is trying to attribute any reasons related to her son’s foul behavior whatsoever. No one is saying she died because he he said that the New Testament should have been about him (or whatever it was that he said). No one is saying her death is tied to his behavior. )
All is well and thank you for the clarification because I had began to conclude otherwise
Yea, former college English department heads certainly make way more than enough to consult and afford Beverly Hills cosmetic surgeons
.
hi ic, first of all i thank you for the cordial way in which you addressed me. i don’t ever remember you once acknowledging me with a “hi”, so i really appreciate this gesture. secondly, i also appreciate the way in which you showed a more compassionate response to donda west’s death- that’s all i was looking for. i read the link to the article on plastic surgery, and i agree with the writer’s assessment that the decision to have it done should be motivated by necessity (eg. deformities and birth defects) rather than vanity. while i also feel like you do that elective surgery is vain, and an extreme thing to do to oneself, i suppose that i am a hypocrite to speak against it being that i sometimes tweeze my eyebrows and straighten my hair which are not naturally that way. although one procedure is definitely costlier and riskier, the bottom line is that the focus is on our self. even though as a godly woman i adorn myself in good works, and have grown in the area of developing a meek and quiet spirit -which my husband greatly appreciates ;)- he still likes very much when i look a certain way. 1 Cor. 7:34.
i just know that as it is with all comparisons, the things we do never seem AS bad, extreme, frivolous, etc. as what someone else has done. i’m being facetious with you ic, but i guess Christian women could solve one of the issues of vanity by just wearing burkas, huh? clean hearts, good works and burkas. whatcha think? thanx for the dialogue. (warm smile)
mrs. maverick, I’m actually going to start marketing a line of Christian burkas first thing next year. They have a cross on the front, back and top of the head piece. Just send me a love offering and I’ll ship you one. I’m also looking for models for my marketing campaign if you are interested and your husband willing to allow it? Tell him that he can trust me, that nobody will see anything
.
ic, you peddlin’? say it ain’t so!
I figured with so many pimps falling in 2007, that somebody would have to represent for 2008
.
Mrs. Maverick.
I have always agreed with you on the most part. But we will have to part ways on this one. We live in a culture that is dominated by appearance. What I am not saying is that God punished her for such a decision, I would actually believe not, but I can’t say either way.
I will say we live in a nation that borrows 10’s of billions of dollars to be made up on the outside and are as ugly and wicked as can be on the inside. To say that these things aren’t sinful may be wrong. For example. I am sister in Christ who struggles with “self esteem”. One of the main factors is that men don’t notice me. So I go get a breast implant or a tummy tuck in order for me to be noticed and to love myself. Now if you don’t think something is wrong with that I have to take you toe 1 Peter 3 and 1 Timothy 2. People in America spend hours per day on their form but are as empty as ever. We have no depth as it relates to character, integrity, selflessness, but we sure do look good. If our focus is on our outside in order to build self confidence then I will say your focus is wrong. I will however make excpetions for those who are born deformed or for women who get breast reduction for health reasons. But typically what is going on is we are walking around like “gold plated dung” Beautiful when passing by but if paid attention to is not only disgusting but also useless.
Brothers, brothers, please know that this surgery is no longer for the rich. In addition, it is often prescribed for health reasons. To the point, we don’t know why she had the surgery or where the money came from to pay for it.
The absolute in this case is: the woman is dead and I think we should let her rest in peace.
(MN: If she wasn’t saved before she died, she won’t be resting in peace. )
Tru dat Melvin–that is a fact.. Can we say she didn’t repent before she left here?
We just don’t know why it happened and we had no clue when it was going to happen.
Same holds true for a saved person who is critically ill. Although we may know that death is on the horizon, we don’t know the hour or minute.
B&reformed, what’s your point, “all is vanity” what do you expect from a sinfully Godless nation? Don’t be disappointed :(, as earth, wind & fire said, “That’s the way of the world”
MN my apologies, I saw the italics and assumed it was you, IC please explain…..
It’s already been explained.
Don’t know what your talking about Msamu. I am talking about believers not non believers here. Read my post again before you respond. Believers are not Godless we are the Bride of Christ. So maybe you want to respond to someone else.
IC you said “It’s already been explained”
where?????????
Agreed Melvin–that’s all I can say to is that the woman died of complications due to cosmetic surgery
hi lionel, we’re not always going to be in perfect agreement but we’re still cool
re: your comment to me; i started writing about how i feel about Christians having plastic surgery that i’m going to post on my blog. i’ll address the issue at length so as not to drag this sidebar out on mel’s site. i’m sure ic will appreciate this, lol.
Always! Hey I forgot to hit you back did you get the issue fixed on your blog?
Ms mav, I’m a wateing
i suppose even some Christian men wouldn’t mind their wives doing that one)
don’t even start mav! lol
IC, I could be right or wrong, but I believe that because Kanye West blasphemed God’s name in songs and gained recognition for it, it is possible that he’s paying for it and it may have been through his mother. Didn’t he also say that he was Christ or something like that? Since this blog is about Kerney, he would have to answer to Him too, with his blasphemy. Kerney would be on television and ask the people whom he supposedly heal that if he’s lying, then tell him he’s a lying prophet. Remember Leroy Jenkins? He puts people up to the same challenge too. I felt that I had to let some of these thoughts out so forgive me for being a little off topic.
Trash rapper who claims the Lord’s name K. West also did a photo where he donned a crown of thorns.
I look at it like this. He sees his mother is now dead. A man thinks deep about something like that. I’m sure it’s crossed his mind how if he never ran up the ranks of trash music he might be broke, but his mother would not have died like that. Trying to look more beautiful for her next photo with him. I’m sure it’s tearing him up inside.
(And for you who feel she had to go at her “appointed time”, you don’t know what her “appointed time” would have been if things were different. Because if things were different, perhaps everything would be different including God’s appointed time for her death, if K. West did not chase money and forsake the truth of the Lord Jesus.
Perhaps God would not have appointed the time for so many Black young men to die so early if so many Black young men were not shooting at each other in the streets.)
Angela, perhaps God is trying to humble him. Although I’ve seen some people who mock God see little or no oddly timed deaths, perhaps for K. West God wanted to send him a message in this way.
HELP
MN said :(And for you who feel she had to go at her “appointed time”, you don’t know what her “appointed time” would have been if things were different. Because if things were different, perhaps everything would be different including God’s appointed time for her death, if K. West did not chase money and forsake the truth of the Lord Jesus.
Msamu; Mn your kidding right, you preached to me how everything is God’s will, the death of Ms West, the success of K. West according to your doctrine was ordained of God before the beginning of time. Their can be no speculation here, how could thing’s have been different? How could they have chosen another path when God decreed their path, are you now stating she had free will to choose her destiny?
According to your doctrine of God’s sovereign grace ( for his glory )
1. God ordained K. West’s success
2. God decreed Ms .West death on the day she die
3. it was decreed that K. West was to forsake truth
you should be (if) less, sovereign Grace does not allow for any if’s
(MN: Why do you guys keep saying I said something about KW’s mom? I don’t recall typing anything about it. IC did. And I believe a couple of others did. But I don’t think I have said anything about them. Of course, I could be wrong on that. But I don’t think I am. )
And Mn How can Oprah drag people to hell, their already in hell, remember??? (MN: No. They’re not in hell until they are cast into hell. And if they are of the elect, they will not die without Jesus Christ. Is Oprah of the elect? I DON’T KNOW. )
(MN: DTG, let me say it again. I don’t know who is of the elect and who is not. Did KW’s mom’s death catch God by surprise? No. Did He ordain it? Yes. Oprah is doing and saying the things she says because God has ordained that it should be so. Is she responsible for what she says? Yes.
Again, I don’t know who is of the elect or who is not. I preach the gospel (when I am obedient) to all. The phrase “dragging them into hell is something called a figure of speech. It is also consistent with scripture when it states that the people are blinded by the god of this world.
Where in what I said spoke of his mom’s free will to pursue her destiny?
I suspect the mistake you keep making is playing what if games as if they make a difference. KW’s mom died as a result of a bad plastic surgery procedure. That is what happened. What might have happened is irrelevant.
If she hadn’t got the procedure she wouldn’t have died - meaningless. She did get it and she did die.
If KW hadn’t been successful, she wouldn’t have been able to afford the procedure. Meaningless. She got the procedure and she died.
What ifs don’t change what is. )
MN you’re wagging the dog here, you implied Ms. West could have changed her destiny MN said “perhaps everything would be different including.
God’s appointed time for her death,”
again, how could she have changed GOD’S APPOINTED time??? (MN: She couldn’t have. Why do you remind me of a 2D being trying to argue with a 3D being? )
(MN: DTG, I didn’t say any of this. That was IC. It’s similar to saying “If the pedestrian had paid attention before he stepped off the sidewalk, he wouldn’t have been run over by a truck.” or “If Pharoah had allowed the Israelites to leave in peace, his entire army wouldn’t have been destroyed.” The “ifs” in these cases don’t throw God’s sovereignty into question. If KW had not made a fortune as a potty mouth, his mom wouldn’t have been able to afford the operation. And she wouldn’t have died. Again, this doesn’t imply the ability to alter God’s decrees. It is simply the ruminations of humanity. If the Duke hadn’t been killed, then World War I would not have decimated Europe. If Hitler hadn’t moved a few feet in his trench during World War I he would have been killed along with the rest of his group and we would never have experienced World War II. If Einstein had decided to become an engineer with his dad, we likely would not have developed the nuclear bomb…etc…etc…etc. None of these ruminations challenge the sovereignty of God. They are simply “What ifs”.)
Melvin, you called msamu “DTG”. Are they one and the same?
(MN: No. I made a mistake. Sorry. )
Melvin,
I’m sorry for opening a discussion of debate, regarding Kanye West’s mother. I would like to say that when I questioned IC about her death, I realize that everyone does have their appointed time on this earth but I figure that there were contributing factors and responsibilities that comes with it. You mentioned that Oprah says the things that she said is because God preordained it. Is she responsible and you replied yes. That was exactly what I was getting at with this. I truly believe that when Kanye was blaspheming His name and bankrolled on it, including his manager, record company and family, they were asking for it. I also believe that God has a way of instead of direct punishment, he’ll get the ones closest to you. It happened to David in the bible and I know that Kanye is not saved, but I used David as an example that it has happened to others like that. Randy and Paula White has a daughter at death’s door with cancer and they are divorcing. I believe that aside the fact it is her possible appointed time to die, their blasphemy and adulterous marriage was an contributing factor and they are responsible. I am not saying that God will punish everyone that way, but some have gotten it that way. To add, everyone has to pay for their own sins and stand before God anyway.
Melvin,
We are not talking about my former Bingo partner back in the day, Ann Iverson! lol Donda West could hold her own, I believe and would have been okay if her son never sold a song…
Bio of Donda West:
Earned a bachelor’s degree in English from Virginia Union University in 1971 and a PhD from Auburn University in 1980. She was also a Fulbright scholar who studied in Nanjing, China.
In 2007, she released a book called “Raising Kanye: Life Lessons From the Mother of a Hip-Hop Superstar”.
Previously taught in the early 1970s at Brown College in Atlanta. She served as chief executive of West Brands, the parent company of Kanye’s business enterprises, and as chairwoman of the Kanye West Foundation, a nonprofit that works to decrease dropout rates and improve literacy.
Was professor and chair of the English Department at Chicago State University from 1980 to 2004, and retired to become her son’s manager. Former chairwoman of Chicago State University’s English department.
Big Mel, why do you keep addressing me when msamu writes? You will see the difference between us on Friday LOL. I never said anything about the elect or sovereignty this time but you keep putting me in it. I said something to I. C. Man, what’s up!!!
Not to besmirch a recently dead woman, but you’d think someone educated would know better than to dance on stage in endorsement of a trash rapper, even if its her son.
This article notes:
Coroner awaits toxicology test results in death of Donda West
She changed her mind about the surgery several times. We’re not seeing any indication of medical necessity. And one doctor had already refused her. So it was known that she was HIGH RISK before the surgery.
Donda West Warned About Surgery
A good doctor was advising AGAINST this surgery. So she went to a guy who while known has some legal issues.
But looking at this from a Christian perspective. Can a doctor who does a bunch of elective cosmetic surgeries knowingly do that kind of work as a saint? It seems it would work on the conscience a lot. I’m not thinking a true saint could continue doing various elective surgeries for very long. Knowing they line their pockets in the name of “vanity”.
Perhaps Donna West had back pain issues, which would make surgery understandable, but given she took to the stage with Mr. Trash…if she was the Lord’s she would have heard the call to Him in the midst of being near death.
I still maintain that this plastic surgery culture is way out of hand. Plenty of people claim to need it now, but not so many people seemed to need it till it became the popular thing to do.
Gm IC,
All understood but one quote:
Perhaps Donna West had back pain issues, which would make surgery understandable, but given she took to the stage with Mr. Trash…if she was the Lord’s she would have heard the call to Him in the midst of being near death.
Nonetheless, this woman was not small by any means and I can see why she “may” have had some back issues.
I can honestly say that I have no clue what was going on with Ms. West…however, in all fairness, it was a personal choice for her. Because I have no access to her medical or financial records, all I can say is that she died.
But we’ve gone from the patient to the doctor. Of course, a good Christian doctor would not perform a procedure that was known to be detrimental to a patient’s health. But even then, this is hard for an outsider to prove because people get second opinions all the time. Thus, it is possible that two Christian physicians can have two different opposing views on perspective treatment plans.
I am with Melvin 100% this time; there are just too many “what if’s” to make a logical conclusion.
I don’t know about anyone else, but I am lost as to:
1. Why she chose to have the surgery
2. The absolute cause of death
3. Prior medical advice and history that may have or may have not suggested that she have the surgery
4. The cost of the surgery and who paid what
3. Was she saved or not at the time of death
I do agree with you that some get the surgery and don’t need it. I have a cousin who is financially well off. She has two small children, ages 1 and 7. After her second child at age 33, she decided to have a tummy tuck. Mind you, she aint big no where but could not stand her stomach. Thus, she had the surgery over the summer and could not work. As a consequence, her mother had to use her vacation time to take off work to help with her children and household and her husband was forced to take the daughter elsewhere to have her hair combed cause her mother could not bend.
Now, at around 5′5, 150 and a size 12–why would a healthy woman want a tummy tuck? Secondly, why make yourself disabled to the point where you can’t take care of your own children and household if it is not medically necessary? Truthfully, this is the real reason why my sister, who really needs the surgery at 5′2 and about 230 is reluctant to get it–she saw how my cousin suffered so bad and she doesn’t have the resources to pay someone to help her out when she becomes totally incapacitated because of the surgery.
I can speak out in this instance cause I am well aware of the entire situation cause I asked some very hard questions when I was asked to come to their home to perform “domestics” LOL!!! And to prove your point, “this” instance was vain…
Seriously, I feel you on where you’re trying to go with the thing, but unless we are certain as to motive, I think we would do best to gather the facts before we speak out on issues because it ends up being gossip if what we speak is not the truth
Thanks for a good discussion
Righter, did you know that Donna West was Kanye’s manager? See here.
She was no small woman, but I can’t say she was the Lord’s either.
I’m not saying what her motivations for surgery were at this point (although the tummy tuck portion is never for medical reasons, the upper region reduction often is), but it’s obvious she should not have had the surgery performed and should have got herself checked out for clearance like the first doctor recommended. More than all this, she needed to embrace Christ in truth and tell her son she would not help him with production of that kind of material. But what is done is as the Lord has established before the foundation of the world. All is for His glory and He being the One sovereign God I’ll leave it at that.
Really I started all this because I was tired of seeing debate about OJ further up in this tread. I mean how many discussions can be had about “OJ”
… I really mentioned Kanye to show how off topic things can become and it kind of ballooned.
I just wanted to shift things a bit. So as long as saints know WE should avoid being caught up in vanity we are on one accord and doing well.
I think ultimately the sidebar to the sidebar has had a good conclusion.
not yet, i still have to address bar’s comment to me lol.
hi melville, i was gonna wait until friday when i see you- but i figured, what the hay- let me get the ball rolling and we can pick it up this weekend. i’m confused by some of your mns, really, i am. if i understood you correctly the first few times, it seemed as if you were saying that everything that happens in this life is God’s will. nothing happens outside of His will for He has no permissive will. everything that happens is for His glory and for His good pleasure regardless of whether it be good or evil in our sight. if this is indeed the doctrine of God’s sovereignty, wouldn’t that also apply to donda west’s surgery and subsequent death? (MN: Yes. ) or the shooting deaths of our black youth, or anything for that matter? (MN: Yes. ) i’m honestly not trying to be flippant here but your speculative comment regarding kanye’s mother’s choice to have surgery leaves me wondering why you would say (perhaps everything would be different including God’s appointed time for her death, if K. West did not chase money and forsake the truth of the Lord Jesus. ) (MN: What if’s are just that - what ifs. What might have happened had KW not become famous isn’t really an issue. IT’s not a matter of her being ordained to die on November 20th and it was just a matter of how it was to happen. It happened exactly when, and exactly in the way God ordained it. It’s not a matter of perhaps she wouldn’t have died if she hadn’t had the procedure done, thus getting around what God had supposedly ordained. That which God ordains happens, period. Talk to Pharoah, the Babylonians, and Judas.)
God could have stopped her from dying (and at this point, i don’t even know if her death was a result of post -operative complications). it would be more consistent with your sovereignty belief to say she was going to die that day simply because it was already ordained for her to die. (MN: Exactly. ) i’m sincerely confused here. God could have stopped her from having the surgery, as He could have stopped the boys from shooting etc. etc. but He didn’t. (MN: Not only did He not stop them. They all happened exactly as He decreed. Do I understand why He would so decree? No. But the Bible clearly indicates that He does. )
so if i follow your teaching, then i have to conclude that it was decreed for donda west to have the surgery because she had enough money from her son’s earnings which was decreed that he earn.
or… perhaps, i’m missing something here. please explain the difference. (MN: No. You’re not missing anything. )
Wow! From OJ to Donda West. Are we back to Kerney Thomas? Don’t tell him that he’s not ‘anointed’.
Regarding Kerney Thomas, this video exposes him big time!
(Better save a copy, pimps like to get that kind of stuff removed from YouTube.)
IC, After seeing that video, I hope that this caller went to the emergency room.
Kerney-”Did you FEEEEEEEEL that??”
Caller-”NO.”
The lighter side of things………..
I can neither confirm nor deny this.
I may have stumbled upon Kerneys intercession and guidance for a certain Pimp in question as of late. I think this may be the proof that Melvin needs.
J.B. AKA Michael
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZRDepXew9ZY&feature=related
Laugh a little.
Kyle
is this guy real? like do his “miracles” really work?
im confused
No. And nobody that acts like him is.
Yeah he is too funny. The first time I saw him, I thought it was a sketch from Mad TV or something. With his high pitched “God” cries. Sounding like the pastor version of Howard Dean. Ha!
I am trying to maintain my sanity right now! I have never even heard about him until i found this site. My stomach is hurting from all the laughing i am doing! Melvin, is this for real? People believe in this joker? I am also praying that the gentleman seeks some medical help as soon as possible. It looked like a scene from comedy central. This is so funny that’s it’s sad if you get my drift. Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeseeeeeeeeee!!!!!
I’m so glad I found your blog! LOL. I stumbled on Rev. Thomas a few weeks ago and was mesmerized by his performance. I thought to myself “Is this guy successful?” I caught his act again this morning and thought I would google about a bit.
I have to agree with another poster that I often do feel like throwing up, just a bit, when I catch the man on TV. I also have to admit that I really wish I was completely bereft of morals as I’m SURE I could be a freaking millionaire by now. I’ve some scraps of old t-shirts lying around. $7 and they are yours! Oh, and I’ll “anoint” them for you. You bet. Nice blog! =)