This is the last time addressing the building of monuments - for a while anyway. After this, I’ll get back to the unmitigated, living large, take your money pimps.
A reader pointed me to yet another fellow who wants to raise a monument to himself.
Below is a new mausoleum being raised in North Carolina. Actually, it’s an animated architectural rendering of the new mausoleum.
Care to make any guesses on how many people are actually being discipled (as opposed to being stacked up like cord wood in the pews)?
Again I will say that there is nothing INTRINSICALLY wrong with a large structure. But I’m just not seeing the purpose behind the big gaudy buildings these fellows are putting up. If they’re going to insist on doing homeless care and stuff, why not put the money there and just build a prefab steel structure for worship and study. It can’t be done, you say? I disagree.
Here’s a church that did exactly that. It’s a Reformed Presbyterian church in Bowie. As they grew, they built this structure and moved out of the dance studio at the YWCA.
The structure has classrooms and an auditorium/knave. The last time I was in there, they hadn’t installed permanent seats and the auditorium served multiple purposes.
If I remember correctly, the cost of the building was less than $300K. And that was because the building is functional not showy.
Am I saying everybody has to have the same kind of building or that everybody should spend the same amout of money? Not at all. Calvary Chapel has a huge congregation in Costa Mesa California. But apparently they do work at discipling the members. Grace Community, also in California, has a large congregation. But they focus on real discipling. I’m saying the money you bring in should be for promoting the Gospel and for building up the local body, not building up the local infrastructure. You don’t need a cathedral to present the Gospel. And you don’t need an impressive (or tacky, depending on your tastes) mausoleum to disciple.
Jesus wasn’t particularly impressed with the Temple in Jerusalem. You shouldn’t be impressed with the monuments to the pimps either. Instead, be impressed with the job your pastor does at building up the body and equipping you to build up each other. Everything else will burn up at judgment.
One last thing: How many big buildings do you think would go up if these guys had to pay property taxes on the buidlings and the land?
Amen. Well done. Well said. Keep pressing for ministry and pastoral ministry to be done the right way. Also, thanks for acknowledging those who “are” doing what we were saved to do. We are out here. Stay blessed.
Wow! I guess this is what they mean by “Kingdom” business. Thier own personal Kingdoms, that is.
Elevation Baptist Church. Interesting name. Who are they elevating? Let me guess, it’s not Jesus!
With all this money why don’t Black people build comuunities and towns. All the money is going into one building. The Jews take their money and buy buildings and tell their congregation to take over the neighborhood. If I had a couple Million I would start land development and build a village. Sell the houses to my congregation, flip the land and sell it to them and start over. But I be these “people” don’t think like that. They could be making billions instead of millions. If you are going to make money off of people at least give them something in return.
Every pastor needs to know what the Lord commands Christians about money. They have no right to alter these ordinances for their gain or for their pride. The believer is to give alms, which is private giving to one or more of these: The poor brother or sister; the teaching elder; the missionary; the needy neighbor. The only ongoing financial burden that Paul authorized for the church was the support of older, eligible widows as he stated in 1 Tim. 5.
As to buildings, no command could be given because it was impossible to anticipate the economic conditions that would exist throughout the world where the Gospel would go. Some have more money and can afford meeting places - some have no money to spend on such things. In the early church, rich patrons usually supplied the building, or they met in homes throughout the city.
No pastor may create a debt for his people for a meeting place that inhibits them from giving as they are commanded. The pastors must not drain his flock of their resources for either expensive facilities or exorbitant salaries. The pastor responsible for such interference of the church in this matter will answer for it, no doubt.
Y’know, even when I see the classic cathedrals with the 9 million feet high ceilings, my first thought is usually something along the lines of “Boy they could do a lot in here if they just add some floors!”
Mr. Melvin, your recent post remind me of a post I read on defendingcontending.com where First Baptist Dallas is building a church edifice for about a cool $130 million. It looks like someone needs to step their game up. 8o)
The $130 Million Church
(MN: And look at the reason Jeffress presents for building the monstrosity:
John Jenkins, move over. )
That’s what God asked for, a home equal to other spectacular temples-a spiritual oasis in the middle of downtown-not!!!
I’m not impressed by the new Elevator Baptist Church. I only saw one Escalade in the whole video.
Melvin, Thanks for putting the information about Elevation on your site. Their current building is less 5 minutes from my house. At least I know what kind of architectural lunacy is on the way. Thanks Again……
You know I get p***** off everytime I read about a Black Church engaging in building a Church the size of a College Campus.
The saddest part is most of the time it’s located in the most depress area of a town.
(MN: I can say John K. Jenkins, the pastor of First Baptist Church of Glenarden on the Kettering (FBCGotK), didn’t do that. I suspect the average income of the congregation is pretty high and the area they built the monster mausoleum in is well-to-do. In fact, Prince Georges county Maryland has one of the one of the largest concentration of Blacks with some of the highest incomes in the country. The monument and mausoleum is built in the midst of this. But that just means you have a lot of well-to-do Blacks being sent off to hell instead of a lot of poor Blacks with the same destiny. )
Boy just think how many houses could be built with that amount of money.
Think how many small and medium businesses could be created with that amount of money.
(MN: I actually prefer to think about how much of a difference each of the individuals who gave the money could could make in their communities, working together or working as individuals. Each individual is told to go out. Each individual is to make a sacrifice - for the gospel, not for the pastor. Invariably, church programs become a bragging point for the congregation to say “Look at what we are sacrificing so the pastor and his team can do this and that.” The congregation simply comes to church, gets their prayze on, and stops by Red Lobster on the way home. The idea of actually engaging the culture doesn’t cross their minds. Especially since most of them are already engaged TO the cultured. )
Maybe that’s why I don’t trust many of the preachers in my community.
(MN: I see you are in Pittsburgh. Try these:
Providence Church 412-942-1000
Independence Middle School, 2807 Bethel Church Rd Bethel Park, PA 15102
Calvin Presbyterian Church (PCA) 724-863-1192
260 Maus Dr. Irwin, PA 15642
Redeemer Community Church 412 992-7827
5515 Penn Avenue Pittsburgh, PA 15206
Three Rivers Grace Community Church 412-638-1040
1600 Methyl Street Pittsburgh, PA 15216
Just call them and talk to them if nothing else. )
Melvin,
This is news to me about Elevation building their cathedral. Just this year, my sister-in-law began attending that church, and because I doubt very seriously that she has a relationship with the Lord Jesus, I am broken hearted to know that they are falling into the pimps’ trap. In the past, Elevation has been a church known for its service to the community. Though they are not very mature spiritually, at least some of the folks that I know who attend there are not, they have always been warm, generous people who at least knew they needed Jesus, and at best invited all of the homeless from the community around them to come and be a part of the fellowship.
Another thing is that most of the folks that I know there can barely afford to pay their own bills. (My sister-in-law included.) It always baffles me as to how people can give all they have to the pimps, and then go beg Mama’nem for what they need.
I guess this madness will not end until Jesus comes.
By the way, check out another mausoleum in the same community as EBC.
And not unlike Evangel Church here in Prince Georges County, they rent their facilities out. Isn’t that precious? )
I used to belong to Wake Chapel, or as we affectionately called it: “Club Wake” (que in the disco whistles….). So I know you are right on the money, Tee. They put the new Club Wake out on Tarheel Club Rd. - back in the country.
It’s funny how people can castigate the Roman Catholic Church for the “jobs” they did on the people to build those grand edifices, but can talk so highly about what kinds of buildings they’re putting up. I know not every large church congregation is putting the gospel to the wayside, but come on. I just pray for wisdom for pastors and church leaders to become content with what they have and do everything in their power to glorify Christ. That way whether there is big building or a shack- GOD is always glorified.
Pittsburgh has an abundance of churches, (too many in my opinion) and it just takes a little work and you’ll find a couple good ones in almost every neighborhood. There’s also Bethany Baptist Church in Homewood, Kennedy Alliance Church in Kennedy Township and Union Baptist Church in Swissvale.
Off topic…I started memorizing Romans today (only 2 verses deep right now). Would anyone like to join? There are 433 verses…so, if we do two verses a day, we would be done before the end of 2010. We could meditate on it for almost a full two years…up until the world ends in December of 2012.
(MN: I’m “re-installing” Romans 6 and 12 right now. Sure, I’ll take a piece of that. Take a look at the article on memorization and see if it’s at all useful to you. )
Awesome, well, I will either do verse three today or sometime early tomorrow. Want to just e-mail one another and keep up?
Again, anyone else who wants to join in…it will be hard work, but nothing worth doing for the kingdom is easy.
I just read this passage of scripture this morning in 1 Samuel 15:
1 Samuel 15:12, Saul came to Carmel and behold, he set up a monument for himself and turned and passed on and went down to Gilgal.”
Saul had a lot of nerve to disobey God AND then celebrate his own leadership.
And many modern day hirelings are following in Saul’s footsteps and will reap what they sow~
I am a former member at EBC. You would not believe the secret society mentality that goes on there. I feel sorry for people who go there and get sucked into the Dr. Feel Good atmosphere. The Pastor kicked a tongue or two while I was there, but it was almost full blown charasmaniac in the house. Leaders trip me out with this, come and talk to me, but Ima do what I wanna do atitude.
I am a current member of Elevation Baptist Church in Raleigh. We had no parts of this building..Our church has become a dictatorship run by the “Carmichaels” more like “Carmike Theater”. Please pray that the IRS does what they need to do and we can worship God again. The people are perishing for the lack of knowledge. The first family is robbing us without a gun.
(MN: One of the actions you might want to consider is leaving. You apparently are not getting the Word there. You are being abused. Don’t continue giving them money or the use of your other resources. Get out. Run and find a healthy church ( http://www.9marks.org is a good place to start. )